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The Fox
March 17, 2010, 8:18pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Anyone know of any other examples appart from Dunoon?  There surely must be the  odd one or two in Lanarkshire Captain.

See page in the Wiki.
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the_historian
March 17, 2010, 10:06pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Mystery
Posts: 233
There's three in my area that I know of- Clark St, Bannockburn; Craighall St, Stirling and South St, Cambuskenneth
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The Fox
March 17, 2010, 10:10pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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There are clearly more than I thought.  The one in Dunoon is the only one I have noticed for years.  I might need to rethink this one.  Perhaps listing those found with a pic of a typical one for each area would be better.

Suggestions welcomed!
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BenCooper
March 17, 2010, 10:52pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Illusion
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There's a couple in Bearsden...
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The Fox
March 17, 2010, 10:56pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I am begining to feel left out.  I don't even have a street light outside my house1
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Captain Brittles
March 17, 2010, 11:13pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Except for the burghs we didn't have provosts in Lanarkshire though they have two now in the new divided county, its a bit like the two Koreas here noo.

Apollo has a couple of Glasgow ones a brisk walk away.
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The Fox
March 18, 2010, 9:19am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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As far as I recall it was only Burghs that had Provosts.  I am trying to get both my memory cells going to recall what the heads of County Councils were called.  So far I have been unsuccessful in doing so.
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Apollo
March 18, 2010, 10:41am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Don't forget that what we refer to as a Provost Light or Provost Lampost originated from the Baillie (or Bailie) Light.

The baillie was a local civic officer in Scottish burghs, roughly equivalent to a baliff, alderman or magistrate in other countries.

It seems Scottish barons often appointed a baillie as their judicial officer, and they were responsible for a jurisdiction called a bailiary (bailiery).

The Provost Lamp fell out of favour in modern times. Formerly attached to the baillie's house, this became somewhat impractical with the advent of tenements and then multi-storey flats, where the holder no longer had a front door that led off the road.

It seems that in some burghs, the custom is-was to leave the holder with one light in place after they relinquished the post, but I can't recall any single lights - but may just failed to have noticed the count - and from memory, can only think of some pairs.

I recently came across what appeared to be another pair in the back streets of Tollcross, but have only seen them through a camera lens, and not (dared) walk down there yet to confirm what may appear on the glass.
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Captain Brittles
March 18, 2010, 10:49am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Apollo, there were two in Sandyhills Road outside a house, near the Killin Street end.

I can only speak for Lanarkshire - pre 1975 - but as far as I know county council had no political head.

Minute books I've searched through indicate individual chairmen of committees e.g General Purposes, Education, Roads etc.

The position of Lord Lieutenant was and still is the titular head of the county - even though its in two bits now.
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Apollo
March 18, 2010, 11:08am Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Yes, I know the pair you mean - "opposite" the golf course

I'm not even sure they are still there, as I pass the location almost daily, and don't recall noticing them

I will pay more attention next time though.
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the_historian
March 18, 2010, 12:53pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Mystery
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Quoted from Apollo
It seems that in some burghs, the custom is-was to leave the holder with one light in place after they relinquished the post, but I can't recall any single lights - but may just failed to have noticed the count - and from memory, can only think of some pairs.


Just to confuse things further, the examples in Cambuskenneth, Bannockburn and Raploch have always been single lamps, and the first two were put there as recently as the '70s. One of the former incumbents is long dead, one is retired and the other still serves as a cooncillor.

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Apollo
March 18, 2010, 2:00pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Single and double may confirm regional differences, but I am sure those who live under Glasgow council will have no doubt that their councillors believed that the chosen amongst them deserved at least two lamps outside their homes to show their importance, and fuelled by taxpayers' electricity too.

At a guess, if Edinburgh could have made a reason for three, then that would have been the custom there

It would be no surprise to learn that the practice began to die off from the 1970's onward, with perhaps a few who saw the award of the light as part of their post insisting that the lights were fitted, so the neighbour's knew they were in the presence of elected royalty.
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The Fox
March 18, 2010, 4:17pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I am sure ir died out with regionalisation - there were no provosts after that.

Re County Councils - I think the head honcho was just known as the Chairman of the County Council.

Nowadays, locally at least, all councillors are awarded the same perk as far as I am aware.   They get the pavement outside their houses swept monthly.
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the_historian
March 18, 2010, 4:36pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator
Mystery
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It did die with regionalisation Fox, but Stirling revived the title in the late '90s-
http://www.stirling.gov.uk/index/stirling/stirling-city.htm
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The Fox
March 18, 2010, 6:04pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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There was some controversy in Oban a few years ago when the Community Council tried to promote the Chair to Provost of Oban.   As far as I remember they did not get away with it.
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Apollo
March 18, 2010, 6:42pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Quoted from the_historian
It did die with regionalisation Fox, but Stirling revived the title in the late '90s-
http://www.stirling.gov.uk/index/stirling/stirling-city.htm

Might I point to the Lord Provost of Glasgow - still holding on to the post tightly in the grasp of his/her claw.

You'll never see anything that looks like a perk disappear from the council of the Second City - not without a fight to the death.

This particular species can also be found hanging on tightly in Edinbuegh and Aberdeen.
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The Fox
March 18, 2010, 7:26pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I suppose most if not all of the cities that are big enough to have their own councils may have Provosts.   In the case of Argyll & Bute it would be tricky.  Nobody would  accept private Walsh as the Provost of Lochgilphhead which is where the Council sits.
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Apollo
March 18, 2010, 9:16pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Sad to report that my thought about the lights opposite Sandyhills golf course were correct, and they are gone.

Regrettably, when they were there, it was not at a time when I was taking pics, so there is no record.

I can't even recall which house, and thanks to the state of the road, and the installation of cable, there is no evidence on the footpath, which is just a mess, with no sign of where the light may have been.

I was going to carry on for another look at the Tollcross lights I found, but the weatherfolk were spot-on, as usual, and the rain promised to sweep in and get heavier as the afternoon became evening arrived right on cue, almost the moment I walked out the door.

However, when I checked my Tollcross pics, I found that the long distance pic I had grabbed in passing was perfect, despite the distance, and that pair has been captured:

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JadeFalcon
March 18, 2010, 10:02pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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Apparently there were Provost lights near Danny Cairns old house in Kilmarnock near the Bonnyton area.  Off West langlands street in the area near the former Barclays railway works offices.
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Captain Brittles
March 18, 2010, 10:11pm Report to Moderator Report to Moderator

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I meant to add that the Siamese twins of North and South Lanarkshire both have 'Provosts' who get their pictures in the papers far more than even the local cooncillors.
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